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1/21/2018 5:56:45 AMI Will Build My Church 

rtay
Port Saint Lucie, FL
67, joined Aug. 2010
online now!


Matthew 16:16



"And Simon Peter answered and said, `Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.' And Jesus answered and said to him, `Blessed are you, Simon Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you but My Father who is in heaven. And I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church and the gates of Hades shall not overpower it. I will give you the keys of the Kingdom of Heaven and whatever you shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.'"

I want to focus our attention on one particular part of this text and that is verse 18 where the Lord says, "I will build My church." Men can build buildings and men can build organizations but only Jesus Christ can build the church. There are churches built by men, some of them you have attended, no doubt, as I have. But here our Lord says, "I will build My church," the only one approved by God and supernaturally constructed.

Now as we contemplate the rich meaning of the statement of verse 18, I want to help you look into some of the characteristics, some of the features of the church that Christ is building. First, let's look at the certainty of it...the certainty of it. Without any qualifiers, without any caveats, Jesus said, "I will build My church." That is a divine promise. That is a promise from Christ who is the true and faithful witness, from Christ who is God who cannot lie. That is a promise from the one who faithful and true, the one who cannot speak an untruth, who cannot promise and it not come to pass. That is a promise from the one who keeps His word...I'll build My church.

The future tense does not imply that God has not been doing it, it does imply emphatically that He will continue doing it until its completion. There is so much inherent in this that may escape us. Let me remind you of something in Titus chapter 1, for a moment. In Titus chapter 1, the first two verses the Apostle Paul gives the three main components of his ministry, the three main elements of his preaching and teaching.

One, he was sent from God, a messenger of Christ for the faith of those chosen of God. That is he had an evangelistic purpose. He was to come and bring the message of the gospel which elicited saving faith in the elect. Secondly, his ministry involved the knowledge of the truth which is according to godliness. And he was come also for edification. He was come for evangelism leading to salvation and edification leading to sanctification. And then he says in verse 2, "I was also come to instruct in the hope of eternal life." And here he says I was come for encouragement leading to security, endurance. My ministry then is evangelism, and edification and encouragement. It is to bring people to salvation and sanctification and security about the permanent reality of their eternal life. And all of this...look at the end of verse 2, he says...God who cannot lie promised. And when did He promise it? Long ages ago. Literally what that says is before time...before time. God made a promise to redeem people before time. He made a promise that there was an elect who would come to faith, who would hear the truth and pursue a path to godliness and live in the hope of eternal life. And He made that promise before time.

Go back to 2 Timothy 1:9, just keep that thought, 2 Timothy 1:9, "God...says verse 8...who has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works but according to His own purpose and grace, which was granted us in Christ Jesus from all eternity but now has been revealed." Here it is again. God made a promise, God made a plan involving Jesus Christ, a plan of salvation way back in eternity, before time. That's why Hebrews 13:20 calls this the "eternal covenant."

Now the question immediately that comes to mind is: If God made such a promise to redeem humanity, to whom did He make it? If He made it before anyone was created, if He made it before time, if He made it back in eternity, to whom did God make the promise? In John 17, listen to verse 24, "Father, I desire that they also...listen to this...whom Thou hast given Me be with Me where I am in order that they may behold My glory which Thou hast given Me, for Thou didst love Me before the foundation of the world." That is...just a massive statement that's so transcendent I don't know that we can even capture its significance. What Jesus is saying is this..."Father, there are some people that You have given Me and I want them to be with Me where I am in Your presence, I want those You've given Me to see My glory for You loved Me...here's the line...before the foundation of the world." Now let's follow the thought, let's pull it together.

Before time, way back in eternity, before the foundation of the world, the Father loved the Son. He loved the Son so perfectly that He desired to give to the Son a gift that would somehow express His love. And the greatest gift that the Father could give the Son as an expression of His love was a redeemed humanity. And Jesus is simply saying here, "I want them that You are giving Me, that You've chosen before the foundation of the world, I want them to be with Me where I am to see My glory." In other words, "I affirm the plan, I want it to happen." And in a sense, in the wanting and the affirmation of verse 24 is the inevitability of the cross.

Go back to John 6...back to John 6, familiar words, but here them maybe in a new way. Verse 37, "All that the Father gives Me shall come to Me and the one who comes to Me I'll certainly not cast out." Why? Because he's a gift from the Father, he's a gift of love from the Father, I'm not about to cast him out, I'm not about to spurn the Father's love, "For I have come down from heaven...why?...not to do My will but the will of Him who sent Me." And what is the will of Him who sent Me? "That of every one He gives Me I lose none, but raise them up on the last day. So this is the will of My Father that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him may have eternal life and I Myself will raise him up on the last day."

In other words, Jesus said, "Look, I've come into the world to do the Father's will. And the Father's will isn't some multiplicity of things, the Father's will is for Me to come and do the redemptive work on the cross which will provide the salvation by which the Father can give Me...the elect. He wants to give Me this redeemed humanity as a gift of His love and I have come down from heaven to do My part to make that a reality. And My part, obviously, is to die and to rise again that I might provide resurrection for them." cont.

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1/21/2018 6:05:29 AMI Will Build My Church 

rtay
Port Saint Lucie, FL
67, joined Aug. 2010
online now!


So when Jesus said He had come to the Father's will, what He meant by that was to fulfill the plan of God in eternity past, the covenant that God made to give to Christ a redeemed humanity and Christ in order to receive that redeemed humanity had to play a part, namely to come and die on the cross. The wonderful, wonderful conclusion of this is in 1 Corinthians chapter 15, don't turn to it, I'll just read it to you, it says there, that ultimately, "Everything will be put in to Christ's control and when all things are subject to Christ, then He says, all things are put in subjection. What does He do? The Son Himself then, verse 28, will be subjected to the one who subjected all things to Him, that God may be all in all." What will happen? The Son will say, "I have received this redeemed humanity as a gift of Your love, I have received them, Father, and now I give them back to You as a gift of My love to You." This is immense. When we read in the Scripture Jesus' words, "I will build My church and the gates of Hades will not prevail against it," what He means to say is, "I am coming to earth and I am going to do the redemptive work and I am going to do what must be done to redeem all those who are the elect from all the way back in the beginning to all the way to the end, My death will make provision for all the elect, I will do that, nobody will be lost, I will raise them all because this is My part in fulfilling a role in the Father's plan to give Me a love gift, a redeemed humanity which in the end I will give back to Him as an expression of My own love."

The certainty then of the church is based on the unchanging, unwavering, absolute promise of God and the power of God to effect the fulfillment of the promise. That's why when you go in to the book of Acts you read things like this in chapter 2 verse 39, "For the promise is for you and your children and for all who are far off...that is Jews and Gentiles...as many as the Lord our God shall call to Himself." That's why in verse 47 you see the Lord adding to their number day by day those who were being saved as He is collecting His redeemed assembly. That's why in chapter 5 verse 14 it says, "And all the more believers in the Lord, multitudes of men and women were constantly adding to their number." That's why in chapter 11 of Acts and verse 24, "Considerable numbers were being brought to the Lord." And over in chapter 13 verse 48, it just keeps going like this, we read, "And when the Gentiles heard this they began rejoicing and glorifying the Word of the Lord, and as many as had been appointed to eternal life believed." The book of Acts starts the flow after Christ's resurrection of gathering the redeemed humanity.

And so the Lord says, "I will build My church." And it's a far bigger plan than any of us could ever conceive of as He fulfills His part in the Father's expression of love to Himself. Will you please understand this? The primary reason for your salvation is not to keep you out of hell, it's not to make you happy. The primary reason for your salvation is so that you can spend forever and ever and ever and ever glorifying Jesus Christ. That's the Father's purpose and the Son's purpose is to have you do the same for the Father. That's the infinity of this glorious plan.

This simply means that we're not building the church. Do you understand that? We cannot figure out a better way to get more folks in than God had in mind. Nor can we mess it up so fewer arrive than He planned on. It doesn't matter what human means we use, we cannot increase the number that God has ordained, and nor can we decrease it by our ineptitude. We are endeavoring to be holy and faithful and obedient so that God can do His work and we may have the privilege of being instruments in it. There is such certainty here. Against all the opposition of human wisdom and all the assistance of human wisdom, against all the efforts of carnality and ineptitude and indifference and apathy and apostasy and liberalism and error, against all the denominationalism and fanaticism and everything else, the true church will be built. If God's going to do it, it can't be stopped.

Secondly, I want you to notice the intimacy of it...the intimacy of it. Jesus said, "I will build My church." It was His by right, the Father said it was His. The Father made a pledge to give the Son a redeemed humanity, it was His. He personally possesses and owns it. That's such a tremendous truth. You start to see that unfold more clearly, don't you, in John 10 where those magnificent words of Jesus in the context of speaking of Himself as a shepherd says, verse 14, "I am the Good Shepherd, I know My own...I know My own and My own know Me, even as the Father knows Me and I know the Father and I lay down My life for the sheep...I know Mine and Mine know Me and they belong to Me." You are not your own, says Paul, you are bought with a price. Acts 20:28, "He's purchased you with His own blood." First Peter says that it is the blood of the Lamb without spot, without blemish. The price has been paid. John 10 further down in verse 15, the next verse, "I lay down My life for the sheep." And the fruit of that comes in verse 27, "My sheep then hear My voice, I know them, they follow Me, I give eternal life to them, they shall never perish and no one shall snatch them out of My hand, My Father who has given them to Me is greater than all and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand, I and the Father are one." gty.rt

1/21/2018 9:30:27 AMI Will Build My Church 

ludlowlowell
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (37,636)
Panama City, FL
65, joined Feb. 2008


Jesus made Peter the first pope and Matthew 16:18 proves it. Jesus gave Peter authority over the Church and Matthew 16:19 proves that. At present we are suffering under one of the worst popes in history but Matthew 23:3 instructs us what to do when that happens.

1/21/2018 11:48:24 AMI Will Build My Church 

rtay
Port Saint Lucie, FL
67, joined Aug. 2010
online now!


Quote from ludlowlowell:
Jesus made Peter the first pope and Matthew 16:18 proves it. Jesus gave Peter authority over the Church and Matthew 16:19 proves that. At present we are suffering under one of the worst popes in history but Matthew 23:3 instructs us what to do when that happens.


2 Peter 1

1 Simeon Peter, a servant(slave) and apostle of Jesus Christ,
To those who have obtained a faith of equal standing with ours by the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ.
Peter was a slave of Christ,that means he had a Master(Lord Jesus Christ)
That would make Jesus head of the church, if Peter was a pope,then the pope would be a slave of Christ,I guess a lot of popes didn't get the memo.rt

1/21/2018 12:01:37 PMI Will Build My Church 

ludlowlowell
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (37,636)
Panama City, FL
65, joined Feb. 2008


It's a chain of command. First in authority comes God (and Jesus is God) then comes the pope, then the cardinals, then the priests, then the lay people. All authority---Church authority, government authority, parental authority, the boss's authority---comes from God, true, but it is real authority.

You could say that Jesus is t Manager of the Church and the pope the assistant manager. What if the manager announced one day he would be gone for a few days and he was leaving the vice president in charge. What if, during this time, the assistant manager gave me an order which I refused to obey, and I said to the assistant manager, Hey, dude, you're not the manager why do I have to listen to you? What would be the manager's attitude when he returned?

1/22/2018 12:00:06 PMI Will Build My Church 

brashdoc
Over 2,000 Posts (3,589)
Chehalis, WA
65, joined Aug. 2008


Good points Ray! God made ONLY ONE HEAD over the body & He made ONLY one body. The body is vitally connected to the Head, for without the Head the body dies. If the pope dies, the body continues.

Their are many under shepherds but ONLY ONE CHIEF SHEPHERD. There are many bishops/presbyters/elders/overseers etc. of which Peter said he was ONLY ONE of them not OVER THEM.

Who are we going to believe, man exalting man to unbiblical positions or believe the Apostle Peter Himself. He is the one who refutes this exalting a man to an unbiblical position & who exalts Christ above all. He is a true servant of Christ.

1/22/2018 4:34:18 PMI Will Build My Church 

isna_la_wica
Over 7,500 Posts!! (7,945)
Brantford, ON
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Have not read the whole of your posts Ray. Will do when I get more time, just breezed over it all.

I think those that that try to establish a human as being the head of the Church, really fail at taking the passage out of context.

Going by memory here, but if I recall right, just before that verse where Jesus calls Peter, Petros (?) , he was calling Peter "Satan".


So when Jesus said, on one such as Peter( rock or pebble?), I will build my church.

Which indeed he did ! Not because peter was perfect and with out sin, but the opposite !

He built his church, for, and more important, by sinners.

Looking forward to getting back to this thread.

1/22/2018 5:57:52 PMI Will Build My Church 

ludlowlowell
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (37,636)
Panama City, FL
65, joined Feb. 2008


Rejection of the pope=rejection of Christ.

1/23/2018 3:42:45 AMI Will Build My Church 

rtay
Port Saint Lucie, FL
67, joined Aug. 2010
online now!


Quote from ludlowlowell:
Rejection of the pope=rejection of Christ.


Lud, you will take that statement to your grave.

The message of the gospel of Jesus Christ is transcendent.

There’s a second element to Christ building His church. First, a transcendent message. Second, here’s another obvious one, a regenerate congregation...a regenerate congregation. Is it too obvious to say that the church of Jesus Christ is an assembly of believers? Is that too obvious? To call an assembly of non-believers a church is preposterous. A church is an ekklesia, kaleo, called out, called out of death, called out of sin, called out of slavery to Christ. We are the called-out ones. A church is an assembly of believers.

There is this trend today to gather unbelievers in a group and call it a church. How misleading is that? In fact, those who are paraded as the most successful evangelical pastors in our society today are those who are the very best at collecting non-believers. I don’t mind collections of non-believers, I enjoy a football game...baseball game, basketball game, concert. I don’t mind a collection of non-believers. I just don’t like a collection of non-believers called a church.

First of all, it’s not a church. And secondly, it sends a message to the world that if it is a church, this is how the church is. How confusing is that? And yet we seem to be committed to an almost inexhaustible effort to find every possible way to collect non-Christians into a building and call them a church.

What about the true church? Acts 2, again, verse 41, “Those who had received his word were baptized.” Yes they were baptized. Why were they baptized? Because they were told, “Repent and be baptized.” Why? Because this gave them an opportunity to make a public confession of Christ open. And not only a public confession of Christ, but a public confession of Christ in a symbolic demonstration that would portray their death to the old life and the resurrection to the new life, immersion. It was about a public declaration of one’s faith in Christ that led to baptism.
There’s a third component in the early church in the book of Acts. By the way, that does work for church growth. Look at chapter 2 verse 47, the end of the verse. “The Lord was adding to the number day by day those who were being saved.” So regenerate congregation is essential and it doesn’t prevent evangelism. The Lord keeps adding to His church, He’s the only one who can. You can add tares by your ingenuity, only the Lord can add wheat.

The early church preached a very, very condemning message. Chapter 2 verse 40, here’s the message of Peter, “Be saved from this perverse generation.” That’s pretty confrontive. You just called the populace of Jerusalem perverse. And you follow it in chapter 3, preach the same kind of message. Verse 19, “Repent and return that your sins may be wiped away.” Chapter 4 verse 10, “Let it be known to all of you and all the people of Israel that by the name of Jesus Christ, the Nazarene, whom you crucified, whom God raised from the dead. By this name this man stands here before you in good health. He was the stone which was rejected by you, the builders, which, however, became the very cornerstone and there is salvation in...what?...no one else.” Now that is a very exclusive message...very exclusive message.

And I read them an old slab engraving from the cathedral of Lebach, Germany, and this is what it said. “Thus speaketh Christ our Lord to us. You call Me Master and obey Me not. You call Me light and see Me not. You call Me the way and walk Me not. You call Me life and live Me not. You call Me wise and follow Me not. You call Me fair and love Me not. You call Me rich and ask Me not. You call Me eternal and seek Me not. If I condemn Thee, blame Me not.”

One Puritan writer said, “Let me learn by paradox that the way down is the way up, that to be low is to be taken high, that the broken heart is the healed heart, that the contrite heart is the joyous heart, that the repenting soul is the victorious soul, that to have nothing is to possess everything, that to bear the cross is to wear the crown, that to give is to receive.” And then he said, “Let me find Your light in my darkness, Your joy in my sorrow, Your grace in my sin, Your riches in my poverty.” And he ended by saying, “Your life in my death.” That’s the great contradiction.

gty.rt

1/23/2018 4:13:48 AMI Will Build My Church 

ludlowlowell
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (37,636)
Panama City, FL
65, joined Feb. 2008


Believing in Jesus means believing in everything He taught and established. Including the papacy. Including the Catholic Church. Protestantism, the form of Christianity you are familiar with, wasn't even invented until the 1500s, fifteen centuries after the time of Christ.

1/23/2018 6:50:38 AMI Will Build My Church 

rtay
Port Saint Lucie, FL
67, joined Aug. 2010
online now!


Spurgeon said

“Of all the dreams that have ever deluded men, and probably of all blasphemies that ever were uttered, there has never been one which is more absurd and which is more fruitful in all manner of mischief than the idea that the bishop of Rome can be the head of the church of Jesus Christ.” No, these popes die and how could the church live if its head were dead? The true head ever lives and the church ever lives in him. And Spurgeon said, “A man” – this is very interesting – “A man who deludes other people by degrees comes to delude himself. The deluder first makes dupes out of others and then becomes a dupe to himself. I should not wonder but what the Pope really believes that he is infallible and that he ought to be saluted as “His Holiness.” It must have taken him a good time to arrive at that eminence of self deception. But he’s got to, I daresay, by now and everyone who kisses his toe confirms him in this insane idea. When everybody else believes a flattering falsehood concerning you, you come, at last, to believe it yourself or at least to think it may be so.

“The Pharisees, being continually called to learned rabbi, father, the holy scribe, the devout and pious doctor, the sanctified teacher, believed the flattering compliments. They used grand phrases in those days and doctors of divinity were very common, almost as common as they are now. And the crowd of doctors and rabbis helped to keep each other in countenance by repeating one another’s fine names until they believed they meant something. Dear Friends,” says Spurgeon, “It’s very difficult to receive honor and expect it, and yet to keep your eyesight, for men’s eyes gradually grow dull through the smoke of the incense which is burned before them. And when their eyes become dim with self conceit, their own great selves conceal the cross and make them unable to believe the truth.”

Spurgeon said, “Christ did not redeem his church with his blood so the Pope would come in and steal away the glory. He never came from heaven to earth. He never poured out his very heart that he might purchase his people. That a poor sinner, a mere man, should be set upon high to be admired by all the nations and to call himself God’s representative on earth, Christ has always been the head of his church.” Spurgeon knew what the reformers knew, what any true student of scripture knows. The Pope stood at the top of an illegitimate system, particularly and specifically at the top of an illegitimate priesthood. And Spurgeon wrote this, “When a fellow comes forward in all sorts of curious garments and says he’s a priest, the poorest child of God may say, “Stand away and don’t interfere with my office. I am a priest. I know not what you may be. You surely must be a priest of Baal.” For the only mention of the word vestments in scripture is in connection with the Temple of Baal.

Purgatory is what makes the whole system work. Take out Purgatory and it’s a hard sell to be a Catholic. People hang in there because of the deception of Purgatory. Purgatory is the safety net. When you die you don’t go to hell, you go there and get things sorted out and finally get to heaven if you’ve been a good Catholic. Take away that safety net, that’s a hard sell because in the Catholic system you can never know you’re saved. You can never know you’re going to heaven. You just keep trying and trying.

Gty.rt

1/23/2018 8:04:00 AMI Will Build My Church 

ludlowlowell
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (37,636)
Panama City, FL
65, joined Feb. 2008


Ray, did you know Purgatory is explicitly described in the Bible at 1 Corinthians 3:13-15?

1/23/2018 9:44:14 AMI Will Build My Church 

bigd9832
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (21,932)
Chicago, IL
65, joined Oct. 2007


Quote from ludlowlowell:
Rejection of the pope=rejection of Christ.
Believing in Jesus means believing in everything He taught and established. Including the papacy. Including the Catholic Church.


There is no "pope" in the Scriptures. The Catholic church was founded in 1054 AD, not before.

The word "catholic" is not Scriptural.

Quote from ludlowlowell:
did you know Purgatory is explicitly described in the Bible at 1 Corinthians 3:13-15?


CLV 1C 3:12 Now if anyone is building on on this foundation gold and silver, precious stones, wood, grass, straw,
13 each one's work will become apparent, for the day will make it evident, for it is being revealed by fire. And the fire, it will be testing each one's work--what kind it is.
14 If anyone's work will be remaining which he builds on it, he will get wages.
15 If anyone's work shall be burned up, he will forfeit it, yet he' shall be saved, yet thus, as through fire.


There is no "purgatory" in the Scriptures. Perhaps ludlow needs new glasses.

1/25/2018 6:12:38 PMI Will Build My Church 

brashdoc
Over 2,000 Posts (3,589)
Chehalis, WA
65, joined Aug. 2008


https://www.blueletterbible.org/faq/don_stewart/don_stewart_123.cfm

Purgatory is a belief that contradicts the clear teaching of Scripture with respect to the person & work of Christ. This has not stopped people from attempting to find some biblical support for this non-biblical doctrine.

The passages below are offered for support. However, the verses used to support purgatory do not give credence to this belief.

1. Isa 4:4 When the Lord has washed away the filth of the daughters of Zion & purged the blood of Jerusalem from her midst, by the spirit of judgment & is argued that burning, in this context, refers to the fires of judgment - a hint of the doctrine of purgatory.

It has nothing to do with purgatory but speaks of God refining people in this life, not the next.

2. Mt 5:25,26 Agree with your adversary quickly, while U are on the way with him, lest your adversary deliver U to the judge, the judge hand U over to the officer & U are thrown into prison.

Assuredly, I say to U, U will by no means get out of there until U have paid the last penny.

Some RCC teach that prison is purgatory & the last penny is the complete payment for the purgation of sins.

Paying the last penny has nothing to do with paying for sin in the next life. In Roman law, the plaintiff could bring the accused along with him to the judge; the defendant could settle the matter as they proceeded to the tribunal.

However, once they reached the tribunal, the issue would be settled according to law. Jesus encourages people to settle their differences before it reaches the judge.

3. Mt 12:32 Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come.

It is claimed that this verse has at least an indirect reference to purgatory. It is claimed by RCC that Jesus left open the possibility of forgiveness in the next world.

"This world & the next" was a Jewish idiom meaning "never." In Mk 3:29 & Lk 12:10, it is omitted. They are writing for Gentiles. Both state the blasphemy of the Holy Spirit will "never be forgiven."

Nowhere does it state, or imply, forgiveness can be achieved in the next world. Never means never!

4. 1 Cor 3:10-15 According to the grace of God given to me, like a skilled master builder I laid a foundation & someone else is building on it. Each builder must choose with care how to build on it.

For no one can lay any foundation other than the one that has been laid; that foundation is Jesus Christ. Now if anyone builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw -

the work of each builder will become visible, for the Day will disclose it, because it will be revealed with fire & the fire will test what sort of work each has done. If what has been built on the foundation survives, the builder will receive a reward.

If the work is burned up, the builder will suffer loss; the builder will be saved, but only as through fire.

This passage speaks of the believer being refined by fire. To some it is an indication of a refining place.

"He will be saved through fire" does not mean he will be kept alive in the midst of fire. The fire tests a person's works, not their character. In addition, this testing by fire occurs on judgment day, not in the intermediate state.

5. 2 Maccabees 12:41,42,45 Therefore they praised the work of the Lord, the just judge, who reveals what is hidden & turning to prayer, they asked that this sin might be entirely blotted out.

The noble Judas called on people to keep themselves free from sin...But since he had in view the wonderful reward reserved for those who die a godly death, his purpose was a holy & pious one.

And this was why he offered an atoning sacrifice to free the dead from their sin (2 Maccabees 12:41,42,45, New English Bible).

It's the clearest statement as to some type of sacrifice that can be offered for the dead. Those who died & are in purgatory, can be helped by sacrifices & prayers of the living.

The teaching of a purgatory found in 2 Maccabees has no relevance at all for believers. Also, it is not included in the text of sacred Scripture, hence anything it teaches is not to be regarded as authoritative.

Furthermore, this passage does not teach RCC dogma of purgatory. These soldiers committed what the RCC considers a mortal sin--idolatry. Suffering in purgatory can only forgive venial sins. Mortal sins cannot be forgiven.

6. Heb 9:27 And just as it is appointed for mortals to die once & after that the judgment.

Purgatory believers understand these two events as happening immediately after one another. A person dies & then judgment to determine their destination.

The wicked go to hell while the righteous go to either heaven, if they are in a perfected state or purgatory, if further purification is needed. The RCC believes in these it can find some biblical support for purgatory.

Nothing in the verse mentions or hints of, a purgatory. Furthermore, it does not specifically say the judgment comes immediately after death.

The Scriptures teach the contrary. Judgment only comes after Christ returns & resurrects the dead. This is still future. Hence this verse offers no support whatsoever for purgatory.

Conclusion On Purgatory

We conclude that there is no biblical support whatever for the idea of any believer going through suffering after their death. The passages that attempt to teach this doctrine do no such thing. On the contrary, they contradict any idea that people can pay off sins in the next life before entering heaven.

1/26/2018 5:43:24 AMI Will Build My Church 

rtay
Port Saint Lucie, FL
67, joined Aug. 2010
online now!


Quote from brashdoc:
https://www.blueletterbible.org/faq/don_stewart/don_stewart_123.cfm

Purgatory is a belief that contradicts the clear teaching of Scripture with respect to the person & work of Christ. This has not stopped people from attempting to find some biblical support for this non-biblical doctrine.

The passages below are offered for support. However, the verses used to support purgatory do not give credence to this belief.

1. Isa 4:4 When the Lord has washed away the filth of the daughters of Zion & purged the blood of Jerusalem from her midst, by the spirit of judgment & is argued that burning, in this context, refers to the fires of judgment - a hint of the doctrine of purgatory.

It has nothing to do with purgatory but speaks of God refining people in this life, not the next.

2. Mt 5:25,26 Agree with your adversary quickly, while U are on the way with him, lest your adversary deliver U to the judge, the judge hand U over to the officer & U are thrown into prison.

Assuredly, I say to U, U will by no means get out of there until U have paid the last penny.

Some RCC teach that prison is purgatory & the last penny is the complete payment for the purgation of sins.

Paying the last penny has nothing to do with paying for sin in the next life. In Roman law, the plaintiff could bring the accused along with him to the judge; the defendant could settle the matter as they proceeded to the tribunal.

However, once they reached the tribunal, the issue would be settled according to law. Jesus encourages people to settle their differences before it reaches the judge.

3. Mt 12:32 Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come.

It is claimed that this verse has at least an indirect reference to purgatory. It is claimed by RCC that Jesus left open the possibility of forgiveness in the next world.

"This world & the next" was a Jewish idiom meaning "never." In Mk 3:29 & Lk 12:10, it is omitted. They are writing for Gentiles. Both state the blasphemy of the Holy Spirit will "never be forgiven."

Nowhere does it state, or imply, forgiveness can be achieved in the next world. Never means never!

4. 1 Cor 3:10-15 According to the grace of God given to me, like a skilled master builder I laid a foundation & someone else is building on it. Each builder must choose with care how to build on it.

For no one can lay any foundation other than the one that has been laid; that foundation is Jesus Christ. Now if anyone builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw -

the work of each builder will become visible, for the Day will disclose it, because it will be revealed with fire & the fire will test what sort of work each has done. If what has been built on the foundation survives, the builder will receive a reward.

If the work is burned up, the builder will suffer loss; the builder will be saved, but only as through fire.

This passage speaks of the believer being refined by fire. To some it is an indication of a refining place.

"He will be saved through fire" does not mean he will be kept alive in the midst of fire. The fire tests a person's works, not their character. In addition, this testing by fire occurs on judgment day, not in the intermediate state.

5. 2 Maccabees 12:41,42,45 Therefore they praised the work of the Lord, the just judge, who reveals what is hidden & turning to prayer, they asked that this sin might be entirely blotted out.

The noble Judas called on people to keep themselves free from sin...But since he had in view the wonderful reward reserved for those who die a godly death, his purpose was a holy & pious one.

And this was why he offered an atoning sacrifice to free the dead from their sin (2 Maccabees 12:41,42,45, New English Bible).

It's the clearest statement as to some type of sacrifice that can be offered for the dead. Those who died & are in purgatory, can be helped by sacrifices & prayers of the living.

The teaching of a purgatory found in 2 Maccabees has no relevance at all for believers. Also, it is not included in the text of sacred Scripture, hence anything it teaches is not to be regarded as authoritative.

Furthermore, this passage does not teach RCC dogma of purgatory. These soldiers committed what the RCC considers a mortal sin--idolatry. Suffering in purgatory can only forgive venial sins. Mortal sins cannot be forgiven.

6. Heb 9:27 And just as it is appointed for mortals to die once & after that the judgment.

Purgatory believers understand these two events as happening immediately after one another. A person dies & then judgment to determine their destination.

The wicked go to hell while the righteous go to either heaven, if they are in a perfected state or purgatory, if further purification is needed. The RCC believes in these it can find some biblical support for purgatory.

Nothing in the verse mentions or hints of, a purgatory. Furthermore, it does not specifically say the judgment comes immediately after death.

The Scriptures teach the contrary. Judgment only comes after Christ returns & resurrects the dead. This is still future. Hence this verse offers no support whatsoever for purgatory.

Conclusion On Purgatory

We conclude that there is no biblical support whatever for the idea of any believer going through suffering after their death. The passages that attempt to teach this doctrine do no such thing. On the contrary, they contradict any idea that people can pay off sins in the next life before entering heaven.


thanks for taking the time and bringing more clarity on the issue of Purgatory, Doc.
Its heart breaking to think how many people have embraced Purgatory as a future hope.

1/26/2018 8:07:12 AMI Will Build My Church 

isna_la_wica
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Some excellent points concerning something I my self have messed up previously and have had confused thoughts about.

Its only with hind sight, looking back on my errors , that I can see where I went wrong.

Only the prosperity based doctrine, or the Doctrine of Positive Affirmation, doe more to promote the seepage of the false Karma belief into Christianity ore than the doctrine of Purgatory. One cannot, "pay for their sins".

Where I went wrong? Was by adding a dose of that, while mistaking loving discipline for correction as being "punishment". But it all goes back to the karma stuff ! Any way, this article at CARM, says it all better than I can:

Purgatory and 1 Cor. 3:15

by Matt Slick

We look to the cross and to the cross alone for the complete forgiveness of our sins; and, though our works will one day be judged, we have passed out of condemnation (Rom. 8:1). Our works reflect on rewards in heaven--not to get us to heaven. Jesus bore all our sins (1 Pet. 2:24). There are no sins left for purgatory to cleanse because it was all done by Jesus on the cross. This is why Jesus said, "It is finished!" (John 19:30). In Greek the term, "it is finished," is "tetelestai." It was a term used in legal contexts to state that a debt had been paid in full. "Papyri receipts for taxes have been recovered with the word tetelestai written across them, meaning "paid in full." (Walvoord, John F., and Zuck, Roy B., The Bible Knowledge Commentary, (Wheaton, Illinois: Scripture Press Publications, Inc., 1983, 1985). Therefore, there is no need for purgatory.
Nevertheless, because the Protestants appeal so much to the Bible, the Catholics have sought to find the doctrine of Purgatory within its pages. One such verse is 1 Cor. 3:15.
"If any mans work is burned up, he shall suffer loss; but he himself shall be saved, yet so as through fire."
As with any verse in the Bible, to fully understand it, we must look at it in its biblical context. Following is 1 Cor. 3:10-15
"According to the grace of God which was given to me, as a wise master builder I laid a foundation, and another is building upon it. But let each man be careful how he builds upon it. 11For no man can lay a foundation other than the one which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12Now if any man builds upon the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw, 13each mans work will become evident; for the day will show it, because it is to be revealed with fire; and the fire itself will test the quality of each mans work. 14If any mans work which he has built upon it remains, he shall receive a reward. 15 If any mans work is burned up, he shall suffer loss; but he himself shall be saved, yet so as through fire."

The context speaks of Paul having planted the Corinthian church, and that another person was building upon that work: verse 6 says, "I planted, Apollos watered, but God was causing the growth." Paul goes on to say that unless a person builds upon the foundation of Jesus, his work will be burned up the in the day of judgment (v. 13). See also, 1 Cor. 5:5; 2 Cor. 1:14; 1 Thess. 5:2).
Paul is simply using the terms that are familiar to the people of the time. Fire was the tool used to purify metals and to get rid of that which was unwanted--the dross. So, too, on the day when our works are examined, the fire of judgment will both purify and remove. This will not affect our salvation, but it will affect our rewards. The theme of fire used as purification is also found in 2 Pet. 3:10-13. But this is not talking about becoming saved or staying saved.
1 Cor. 3:15 does not teach purgatory as a place we go to in order to have some of our sins cleansed from us. It teaches that even though the person is justified by faith and cannot face damnation, his works will, however, be judged on "that day." Those works which are good will survive the fires of judgment the way gold, silver, and precious stones can survive fire. But false works will be consumed the way fire consumes wood, hay, and straw. What is left has no bearing on whether or not we are saved. It has to do with rewards in heaven.
Paul goes on to say in 1 Cor. 4:5, "Therefore do not go on passing judgment before the time, but wait until the Lord comes who will both bring to light the things hidden in the darkness and disclose the motives of men's hearts; and then each man's praise will come to him from God."
Note also, 1 Pet. 1:6-7, "In this you greatly rejoice, even though now for a little while, if necessary, you have been distressed by various trials, 7that the proof of your faith, being more precious than gold which is perishable, even though tested by fire, may be found to result in praise and glory and honor at the revelation of Jesus Christ."
2 Pet. 3:10-13, "But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, in which the heavens will pass away with a roar and the elements will be destroyed with intense heat, and the earth and its works will be burned up. 11Since all these things are to be destroyed in this way, what sort of people ought you to be in holy conduct and godliness, 12looking for and hastening the coming of the day of God, on account of which the heavens will be destroyed by burning, and the elements will melt with intense heat! 13But according to His promise we are looking for new heavens and a new earth, in which righteousness dwells."
Purgatory is a dangerous doctrine that makes the Cross of Christ insufficient by requiring the person to undergo suffering in order to be made worthy of being with God. This is a false teaching and is to be avoided. We are justified by faith (Rom. 5:1)--not by faith and works (Rom. 3:28).
Purgatory and 1 Cor. 3:15 | CARM.org
carm.org › Roman Catholicism

1/26/2018 11:05:07 AMI Will Build My Church 

ludlowlowell
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (37,636)
Panama City, FL
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Isna, do you remember the 1960s dance craze known as the twist? That guy who wrote that essay about Purgatory was probably very good at it. No matter how you try to twist it, 1 Corinthians 3:13-15 is about Purgatory.

And we CAN make up our sins by doing acts of penance, through Christ, in this life. Why else does the Lord recommend prayer and fasting? Why do you think the Lord allows painful illnesses or sends natural disasters? If we don't make up our sins in this life we will surely make up for them in the next world---in Hell if we have unrepentant mortal sins and in Purgatory if we have unrepentant venial sins---see 1 John 5:16.

God is not unreasonable. God sends people to Hell for murder, adultery, and fornication, but certainly not for getting angry, gossiping, or the little acts of thoughtlessness and unkindness we descendants of Adam do so often. But these little sins are still sins and, if we are not repentant of them we will still pay for them, but in Purgatory not Hell.

A Christian who has repented of all his minor faults, and who through Christ has overcome them, and who has done sufficient penance (God will accept a long lingering illness as penance for sin if we suffer patiently), that soul can avoid Purgatory and go straight to Heaven when he dies.

1/26/2018 11:46:17 AMI Will Build My Church 

bigd9832
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Quote from ludlowlowell:
Isna, do you remember the 1960s dance craze known as the twist? That guy who wrote that essay about Purgatory was probably very good at it. No matter how you try to twist it, 1 Corinthians 3:13-15 is about Purgatory.


No matter how ludlow twists it, there is no "purgatory" in the Scriptures.

Quote from ludlowlowell:
And we CAN make up our sins by doing acts of penance, through Christ, in this life. Why else does the Lord recommend prayer and fasting? Why do you think the Lord allows painful illnesses or sends natural disasters? If we don't make up our sins in this life we will surely make up for them in the next world---in Hell if we have unrepentant mortal sins and in Purgatory if we have unrepentant venial sins---see 1 John 5:16.


CLV 1Jn 5:16 If anyone should be perceiving his brother sinning a sin not toward death, he shall be requesting, and He will be giving him life for those sinning not toward death. There is a sin toward death: I am not saying that he should be asking concerning that.

1John 5:16 has no "purgatory" nor "venial" sins.

ludlow makes this up as he goes along.

1/26/2018 2:51:40 PMI Will Build My Church 

isna_la_wica
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Quote from ludlowlowell:
Isna, do you remember the 1960s dance craze known as the twist? That guy who wrote that essay about Purgatory was probably very good at it. No matter how you try to twist it, 1 Corinthians 3:13-15 is about Purgatory.


So, your argument against what 1 Corinthians 3:13 - 15 , is based on a dance? Sorry, I cannot dance, sing or play the drums.

Care to say why, you think that summation is wrong?



And we CAN make up our sins by doing acts of penance, through Christ, in this life. Why else does the Lord recommend prayer and fasting? Why do you think the Lord allows painful illnesses or sends natural disasters? If we don't make up our sins in this life we will surely make up for them in the next world---in Hell if we have unrepentant mortal sins and in Purgatory if we have unrepentant venial sins---see 1 John 5:16.

God is not unreasonable. God sends people to Hell for murder, adultery, and fornication, but certainly not for getting angry, gossiping, or the little acts of thoughtlessness and unkindness we descendants of Adam do so often. But these little sins are still sins and, if we are not repentant of them we will still pay for them, but in Purgatory not Hell.

A Christian who has repented of all his minor faults, and who through Christ has overcome them, and who has done sufficient penance (God will accept a long lingering illness as penance for sin if we suffer patiently), that soul can avoid Purgatory and go straight to Heaven when he dies.


No point rehashing our views on Karma with in Christianity Lud. You and I have been through that a lot.

You deny Grace, and I claim Grace is actually what makes Christianity unique among all Religions.

But then again, you also believe your Church is a "replacement" Religion, so do not consider Christianity "unique".

But if you never changed your mind one iota, and I sure have not? No point rehashing that stuff again. Is there ?

Have a good one Lud, hope your day is going well.

1/26/2018 3:39:48 PMI Will Build My Church 

ludlowlowell
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (37,636)
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You knew good and well what I meant by the twist.

Catholics do believe in grace but Catholics, unlike Protestants, don't think that one just believes in Jesus and bang! he or she has all the grace there is. Catholics see grace as coming primarily from the seven sacraments, and we see grace as an ongoing flow from God, not something that comes all at once at a revival meeting.

Grace can be obtained through other channels but the sacraments are the main channels, especially Confession and Communion---the other five sacraments are more-or-less once in a lifetime events only. Protestants don't go to Confession and their "communion" is just a symbol, so Protestants have cut themselves off from grace.

1/26/2018 4:01:54 PMI Will Build My Church 

isna_la_wica
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Quote from ludlowlowell:
You knew good and well what I meant by the twist.

Catholics do believe in grace but Catholics, unlike Protestants, don't think that one just believes in Jesus and bang! he or she has all the grace there is. Catholics see grace as coming primarily from the seven sacraments, and we see grace as an ongoing flow from God, not something that comes all at once at a revival meeting.

Grace can be obtained through other channels but the sacraments are the main channels, especially Confession and Communion---the other five sacraments are more-or-less once in a lifetime events only. Protestants don't go to Confession and their "communion" is just a symbol, so Protestants have cut themselves off from grace.


Your good works as pointed out by Free, come from God. Not you.

Right?

1/26/2018 4:07:04 PMI Will Build My Church 

brashdoc
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Chehalis, WA
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Good thoughts, Ray & Rich! This might be longer but I just kept writing as the Lord brought things to mind.

Jesus said, 'I will build My church.' Whose church is it? It is Christ's church, Christ's assembly, the dwelling place of God IN THE SPIRIT. His kingdom is NOT of this world.

Acts 2:41 Those who embraced his message were baptized & about 3000 were ADDED TO THE BELIEVERS--THAT DAY.

Acts 4:4 But many who heard the message believed & the number of men GREW to about 5000.
Acts 5:14 More & more BELIEVERS were added to the Lord--large numbers of both men & women.
Acts 6:1 In those days when the DISCIPLES were increasing in number...

Acts 6:7 So the word of God continued to SPREAD. The number of disciples in Jerusalem GREW RAPIDLY & a great number of priests became obedient to the faith.

Acts 9:31 Then THE CHURCH THRU-OUT Judea, Galilee & Samaria experienced a time of peace. It GREW IN STRENGTH & NUMBERS, living in the fear of the Lord & the encouragement of the Holy Spirit.

Acts 9:35 All who lived in Lydda & Sharon saw him & TURNED TO THE LORD.

Acts 11:21 The HAND OF THE LORD WAS WITH THEM & a great number of people believed & turned TO THE LORD.

Acts 11:24 Barnabas was a good man, full of the Holy Spirit & faith & a GREAT NUMBER of people were BROUGHT TO THE LORD.

Acts 12:24 But the WORD OF GOD continued to spread & flourish.

Acts 13:4,5 he two of them, sent on their way by the Holy Spirit, went down to Seleucia and sailed from there to Cyprus. 5When they arrived at Salamis, they proclaimed the word of God in the Jewish synagogues. John was with them as their helper.

Acts 13:46-49 Then Paul & Barnabas answered them boldly: “We had to speak THE WORD OF GOD to U 1st.

Since U reject it & do not consider yourselves worthy of eternal life, we now turn to the Gentiles. 47For this is what the Lord has commanded us:

‘I have made U a light for the Gentiles, that U may bring salvation to the earth's ends.’

48When the Gentiles heard this, they were glad & honored the WORD OF THE LORD & all who were appointed for eternal life BELIEVED. The word of the Lord SPREAD thru all the region.

Acts 14:1,3 There (Iconium) they spoke so effectively that a GREAT NUMBER of Jews & Greeks BELIEVED...So (they) spent considerable time there, speaking boldly FOR THE LORD--WHO [HIMSELF] CONFIRMED THE MESSAGE OF HIS GRACE by ENABLING THEM to perform signs & wonders.

Acts 14:21 They preached the gospel to that city (Derbe) & made many disciples...

Acts 14:23 Paul & Barnabas also appointed ELDERS [bishops, overseers, presbyters] (plural) in EVERY CHURCH. With prayer & fasting, they turned the elders OVER TO THE CARE OF THE LORD, IN WHOM THEY HAD BELIEVED (put their trust).

Acts 14:26-28 From Attalia they sailed back to Antioch, where they had been committed to the grace of God for THE WORK THEY HAD NOW COMPLETED.

On arriving there, they gathered THE CHURCH together & reported all that GOD HAD DONE THRU THEM & HOW HE HAD OPENED A DOOR OF FAITH TO THE GENTILES. 28And they stayed there a long time with the DISCIPLES.

Rom 11:3-5 “Lord, they have killed Your prophets & torn down Your altars. I am the ONLY one left & they are seeking my life as well.” 4And what was the Divine reply to him?

“I have reserved FOR MYSELF 7000 men who have not bowed the knee to Baal.” In the same way, at the PRESENT TIME there is a remnant chosen by grace.

I could continue through the book of Acts showing the one true church that Jesus was building & has continued to build since then & how He was doing it. He is doing the same today. Men build their own man-made assemblies; Christ keeps His promise to build His.

There is the remnant chosen by grace & then there are the chaff & weeds planted by the evil one. The devil is building his dark kingdom WITHIN the kingdom Christ is building, His marvelous kingdom of light.

(Here is a passage showing two Persons of the Trinity, The Son & the Holy Spirit building the one true church of Christ.)

http://www.wordsoflife.co.uk/bible-studies/study-8-what-the-church-is-and-how-it-grows/

“With one accord they continued to meet daily in the temple courts & to break bread from house to house, sharing their meals with gladness & sincerity of heart, praising God & enjoying the favor of all the people. And the Lord added to their number daily those who were being saved." (Acts 2:46,47)

Vs 47 tells us something vital about the Church; it is not a building made of bricks & mortar, but is the company of believing people, those who have been born again (Jn 3:3,5) & baptized into the body of Christ by the Spirit, which is the Church (1 Cor 12:13).

As these words were true of the early infant Church, so they are true of the Church today, because for over 2000 years Acts 2:47 has been going on! Every day the Lord has been adding to His Church those whom He is saving. (to be continued)

1/26/2018 4:17:40 PMI Will Build My Church 

brashdoc
Over 2,000 Posts (3,589)
Chehalis, WA
65, joined Aug. 2008


It is the King's PROMISE to us, His body! Hallelujah. Is He continuing to build His one church, His one flock, His one dwelling place in the Spirit? Everywhere in Scripture it says THE CHURCH AT...

The one church at Rome, the one church at Ephesus, the one church at Philippi. Sadly men will change & build a false church, calling it THE Roman Catholic church or Catholic church or the Lutheran Church.

(Luther vociferously fought against anyone making a Lutheran Church but men did it anyway.) Men made a Methodist Church (off Wesley's 'methodism'). Men made a Presbyterian Church (off the type of church government they use).

Are any of these the one church Jesus is building? No. These are all men-made. But WITHIN these man-made structures, can we find those of Christ's one assembly in the Spirit? Yes.

It doesn't matter WHERE people in the dwelling place of God in the Spirit meet; those who have been baptized by the Spirit into Christ's body ARE THE ONE CHURCH OF THE REGENERATED, no matter where or who they meet with or by what name they are called.

Men continue to exalt men & make their own structures & kingdoms & churches.

Those in His one combined flock, His one congregation are called OUT of the world & its system under the prince of the power of the air & brought into God's family.

To build something, one needs a plan or blueprint on what U are building. The structure being build has to 1st have a firm foundation on which to build the structure on top of it, if it is to last.

What is this one foundation? Scripture repeatedly tells us. There is ONE TESTIMONY all the way through the Scriptures. There is the testimony of the Father concerning His Son & the testimony of the Holy Spirit concerning the Son.

Is it the church? No. Is it the Bible? No. Is it works of man? No. Is it the pope or archbishop? No. Is it the traditions of man? No.

It is the REVELATION God has given through His prophets & apostles CONCERNING HIS ONLY SON: HE IS THE FOUNDATION. No other foundation can be laid.

“For no one can lay a foundation other than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ.” (1 Cor 3:11

From Genesis to Revelation, all the prophets & all the apostles all testify to the REVELATION that Christ is the one foundation that one must lay down in their lives BEFORE Christ can build upon it.

Christ's one church, one flock & one dwelling place in the Spirit will last & will be built because it is eternal & Christ has all authority in heaven & earth to accomplish it. What God builds, the gates of Hades & death cannot prevail against it.

The one church is called 'the' PILLAR. A pillar is build upon or ON TOP OF the foundation. It is not the foundation, it is supported by the foundation.

Now one thing thing that never ceases to amaze me is that people flatly disbelieve what Jesus taught.

People will say they are followers of Christ & His Word but then refuse to believe what He said & taught in ALL HIS REVELATION. Not only that, but will teach directly contrary to what Christ taught or commanded.

The issue has always been: belief vs unbelief.

Did God have a blueprint concerning the one true church that Jesus is building? Yes. Who is doing the building & giving the growth? RCC, Baptists, LDS, JW's, Presbyterians, Episcopalians? None of the above.

Only ONE is doing the building & giving the growth: the ONE HEAD of the ONE BODY, the Lord Jesus Christ.

The second thing that never ceases to amaze me is the BLASPHEMOUS teaching AGAINST CHRIST & glorifying Him & recognizing His supremacy & pre-eminence OVER ALL THINGS, INCLUDING THE CHURCH & what He is doing FOR the one true church.

Man exalts mankind. True Christians exalt Christ not mankind nor usurp the glory & the recognition of Christ alone as our salvation. Many ADD to the salvation Christ purchased for us as a FREE GIFT.

Many add additional human beings or added supposed works we MUST do or believe in, that supposedly SHARE in Christ's reconciliation, justification, sanctification & redemption.

This is the one thing that brings righteous anger & indignation to my soul when Christ is ROBBED of His rightful SUPREMACY over all things & ROBBED of the glory of what HE ALONE HAS ACCOMPLISHED AT CALVARY!

Christ did not count it ROBBERY to be in the form of Diety or equal with God His Father yet He voluntarily lay aside certain privileges of manifesting His nature, His glory, omnipotence, omnipresence & omniscience.

This was in order to take upon Himself the form of a SLAVE & APPEAR as a man. God was manifest in the flesh; the Word became flesh & tabernacled among us, as He did back in the wilderness wanderings.

Yet many will ROB Christ of Who He is & what He has done & accomplished ONCE FOR ALL TIME & ETERNITY. It is finished, the opportunity for salvation has now come for all time--yet so many groups & cults will say that it isn't finished.

Christ has to do more, His redemption isn't fully accomplished until this or that is done. Man needs to HELP Christ. His substitutionary death & once for all time shed blood JUST ISN'T QUITE ENOUGH.

This is blasphemy & unbelief! Oh how the enemy of our souls wants to take away from the finished work of Christ.

Just as the Triune God RESTED from His works & was refreshed, so the Son has completed & finished & fulfilled what all the prophets & ALL the apostles have foretold us about. He has SAT DOWN now, waiting until all His enemies are put under His feet. (I Cor 15:25)

Heb 1:1-3 In the past God spoke to our ancestors through the prophets at many times & in various ways, but in these last days He has spoken to us BY HIS SON, whom He appointed HEIR OF ALL THINGS & through whom also He made the universe.

3The Son is the radiant outshining of God’s glory & the exact representation of His Being, sustaining all things by His powerful word. After He HAS PROVIDED purification for sins, HE SAT DOWN at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven.

Man exalts man. The Heavenly Father exalts His beloved Son & the Son exalts His Father & the Holy Spirit glorifies the Son.

And I realize that people are blind & deceived. A spiritually blind person doesn't realize they are blind. A deceived person doesn't recognize they are deceived. Oh the mercy of God to keep us from blindness & deception!

“Woe to U, blind guides...hypocrites! U shut the door of the kingdom of heaven in people’s faces. You yourselves do not enter, nor will U let those enter who are trying to...

U travel over land & sea to win a single convert & when U have succeeded, U make them TWICE as much a child of hell as U are...U blind guides! U strain out a gnat but swallow a camel." (Mt 23:13ff)

One cannot enter Christ's kingdom nor be placed into HIS ONE BODY & ONE CHURCH He is building UNLESS the Father in heaven REVEALS to a person who His Only Son is & the Spirit brings conviction for the unbelief in the Lord Jesus Christ.

And they repent, change their mind & believe now in Christ to save them, believing the testimony God the Father has given concerning His Only Son. (to be continued)

1/26/2018 4:18:12 PMI Will Build My Church 

brashdoc
Over 2,000 Posts (3,589)
Chehalis, WA
65, joined Aug. 2008


Matt 15:12-14 Then the disciples came to Him & said, “Are U aware that the Pharisees were OFFENDED when they heard this?” But Jesus replied, “Every plant that My Heavenly Father has not planted will be pulled up by its roots.

14DISREGARD THEM! They are blind guides. If a blind man leads a blind man, both will fall into a pit.”

The enemy of our souls works day & night to take away the Word of truth, the precious Seed of life, that can sprout, bring life from death & produce a full crop.

The Father REVEALS the truth concerning His Only Son, the Messiah, THE Son of THE LIVING GOD, OUR ABBA!

The Son explains & REVEALS the Father to those who call upon Him to be saved to the uttermost!

The Holy Spirit brings life to spiritually dead people, the lost who do not have God in this world. Christ baptizes the now believer in Him who confesses Him as Lord with the Holy Spirit, who baptizes the believer into the Body of Christ.

We become immersed in the Holy Spirit who then immerses us in the Body of Christ. We are now a new creation, we are no longer the same ever again.

Now we need to learn how to walk in the Spirit by faith, dying to ourselves & allowing Christ to live His life in & thru us.

Zeph 1:7 "Be silent before the Lord GOD! For the day of YHWH is near, For YHWH has prepared a sacrifice, He has CONSECRATED HIS GUESTS. (Lk 14:7-24)

I Cor 3:5-7 What then is Apollos? And what is Paul--servants thru whom U believed, AS THE LORD ASSIGNED TO EACH HIS ROLE. 6I planted & Apollos watered it, but GOD MADE IT GROW so neither he who plants nor he who waters is anything, but only God who makes things grow.

1/26/2018 4:23:32 PMI Will Build My Church 

ludlowlowell
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (37,636)
Panama City, FL
65, joined Feb. 2008


Right.